APEX Express – August 22, 2024 – 8 Years of QTViet Cafe!

KPFA - APEX Express

A weekly magazine-style radio show featuring the voices and stories of Asians and Pacific Islanders from all corners of our community. The show is produced by a collective of media makers, deejays, and activists.

Important Resources

• QTViet Cafe website
• Instagram
• Facebook
• Register for QTViet Cafe’s 8 Year Anniversary
• Bilingual Letter for a Free Palestine (English/Viet)

Transcript

Cheryl Truong: Good evening! You were currently tuned in to APEX Express. I’m your host Cheryl Truong, and tonight is an AACRE night. What is AACRE, you might be asking. Comprised of 11 grassroots, social justice groups, the Asian Americans for Civil Rights and Equality Network — AACRE — leverages the power of its network to focus on long-term movement building and support for Asian Americans committed to social justice. Speaking of AACRE groups, APEX Express is proud to be a part of the AACRE network. Tonight. We have some special guests from a collective near and dear to my heart. Hải Võ and Jean Jean Phạm from QTViệt Cafe. QTViệt Cafe is a project of Asian refugees United, which is one of the 11 Asian American social justice groups within the AACRE network. Hải, do you want to kick us off by introducing yourself? And QTViệt Cafe?

Hai Vo: Co chào mọi người! Hi everyone. Thanks Cheryl for inviting QTViệt Cafe to be here today. My name is Hải. I go by my name. It means ocean in Việt. And just so excited to be here today. , I’m part of the Queer Trans Việt Cafe Collective. We are a cultural organizing hub by and for queer and trans Việt folks for our freedom and liberation.

And we do that through the creative arts, ancestral life ways, and, connecting intergenerationally with our parents, our elders, families, and friends. We’ll be celebrating eight years, and I’ve been a part of it in the beginning when Mơ asked me to help advise and start the project.

What started out as an idea to essentially really bring us together and meet other queer and trans Việt people, and with a little bit of SEED funding from the Impact Hub and Youth Impact Hub Oakland project and fellowship, we’ve been able to not just grow our numbers, but also really more importantly, My healing and then our collective healing.

Just so grateful to be here. And I’m just so excited that Jean, you can join us. Jean is just amazing all around, such a thoughtful intuitive person, designer, friend, just all around beauty of an artist. Thank you for introducing me to the world of visual art and just so many things that you’ve just been exploring over the years. So, yeah, I’ll pass it over.

Jean Pham: Oh my god, thanks Hải. That’s honestly too generous. And thanks for inviting us here, Cheryl.

That’s really awesome that we have this opportunity to share about QTViệt Cafe and our work. My name is Jean. I use they/ them pronouns. I’ve been a part of of QTViệt Cafe since 2018 when I first moved here to the Bay Area and honestly was looking for queer and trans Việt Namese community, which although I grew up in Orange County, I have always found it very difficult to relate and find other QTViets I’ve been a part of the various programming and events that QTViệt has put on, including our Healers and Artists cohort. I think my role in QTViệt Cafe is honestly to just , go with the flow. I try to make myself available as much as I can. I try to help with designing things. A big cornerstone of QTViệt Cafe is repairing our connection with our ancestral and cultural heritage in a way that still celebrates and maintains our queerness and transness at the forefront.

A lot of this I found has been through the culinary arts, which to me was a big point of growth. Literally using taste and smell to connect us with memory and feeling and healing. QTViệt Cafe is honestly such a special place here. It started in Oakland here in the East Bay, but we have members all across the Bay Area and even outwards in different states and locales.

So it’s been a pretty amazing journey to see how vast the QTViet Cafe network has expanded and definitely excited to talk about it. So yeah, I’ll just check there. Again, thanks for having us.

Cheryl Truong: Thanks so much for sharing that, and especially the culinary aspect of QTV, I think is really what makes y’all so, so special.

And honing that ancestral connection through food, too, is something I noticed that you all do , extremely well. Hai brings up that we’re celebrating eight years of QTV at Cafe, coming up very, very soon, which is such a long time to celebrate trans and queer Việt Namese magic. I want to know what does this milestone mean to you, maybe it tastes a certain way, maybe it smells like nuoc mam or something like that.

Jean Pham: Yeah, eight years is a long time. I think it’s longer than any relationship I’ve ever had. , I’ve always found the QTViet Cafe such a beautiful, open space. It’s very different from any organization I’ve ever been a part of. There’s been times when, I’ve been overwhelmed and had to step away, but I’ve always just been invited back and I’ve been given that grace to be as involved as I want to.

There’s something we practice it’s called penguin theory where we try to support the inner penguins like who you know move in advance of work but also have space for us to be modular. We built this bastion of work here in a Bay and I’ve eight years I think really to me starts or begins this journey of connecting with a greater diasporic queer and trans Việt Namese collective.

So, last year was a big points in our journey as QTViet cafe, because we were able to. a fundraise and take about a dozen members to go back to Việt Nam and connect with Queer and Trans Việt Namese in Saigon. And that was just honestly, such like a unbelievable thing. Totally out of my imagination that we were able to do it.

But now it really peaks our imagination of yes, , there’s queer and trans Việt Namese people all over the world. Next year marks the 50th year since the Việt Nam War had ended, and there’s diasporic queer and trans Việt Namese all across the U. S., but also France and Germany, Australia, Japan. We were able to form these meaningful connections here in the East Bay, but I think what I’m thinking about now is how do we take these lessons we’ve learned in community building and creating our own traditions and connecting with other locales, like in the queer and trans people in Australia , LA or New York or Texas of which, they do exist.

There are other collectives, queer and trans Vietnamese there, but, how do we further unite the different threads of Diasporic Viets, and so it’s kind of a very hard question to answer, but I think, again, we have such a strong organizing and magic that I think People that we connect with, they get why does work is important and it’s what’s what’s needed right now. To build these strong points of relationships and solidarity across different locales internationally and outside of our own safe collective spaces.

Hai Vo: Yeah, I resonate with everything that Jean shared. I think for me, eight years of continuing to gather and to organize and to be with one another means that the vision of a cultural healing hub, by and for queer and trans people to learn our ancestral ways, to be creative with one another, to heal with our elders still resonates like it still matters. I’m getting emotional about it because I just been thinking a lot about, this question. We’re approaching 10 years and even 12 years. And I keep asking myself, as a queer Việt person, am I more free? Am I more liberated? I think I want to be asking myself that question deeply in the next phase of my life. Having gone through a journey on my own to explore my own gender, sexuality and be more loving of my trans femness and explore my art around food and food waste and being a diasporic cultural food worker, but also explore my eco- femme writing and erotica. Those things are really exciting for me, but also when we started QTViet Cafe, I came to peace with potentially being estranged from my parents. I noticed that a lot in our community, like that’s a possibility.

After my mom passed in 2018 and inviting my dad to, you know, I’ve invited my parents every year to come to QTViet, they haven’t. Me inviting my dad to bring a picture of my mom for the altar. For me, like, okay, that’s the cultural organizing piece. But deep down, I just really wanted to celebrate my mom and I just wanted my dad to be there. And to like witness how I’ve grown, witness my friends and family, witness the chosen family that I’ve built over time. And my dad came and my dad stayed through the program. My dad donated. My dad could have chosen not to go.

My dad could have left the program. My dad could have not donated. If anything, he could have probably done a lot of things Not in support of what we do. And not to say that this happens with every person or every family, but I think that for me, that’s the power in trying to heal our relationships with ourselves and our families and with each other.

Every year I hear more struggles, as queer and trans Việt people, and I also hear more joys and liberations, and so I think for me, yeah, eight years means that, we still are surviving, and we are still thriving any way that we can. Whether that’s through our foodways, our practice of trying to continue the language, whether it’s connecting on our different art forms, I’m hopeful. Eight years means being more of ourselves, and it means being able to experience one another being more of ourselves.

In my relationship with my dad, I’ve been able to be more honest. I see my dad as more honest, and I hope that by doing this cultural organizing work and arts as a way to practice healing justice, I want more of us to see each other as human. Queer, trans, Việt-ness is not a sickness or a disease. But also our parents are more than that role, that they’re humans who experience war and trauma and are also healing too.

And so, I think, that’s a big part of what eight years means to me. Eight years also means we have, like, hundreds of recipes. I still haven’t written out all the recipes, but in my mental Rolodex, we have lots of recipes, lots of songs, lots of poems, visual , art pieces, photos, videos. We just have so much art that expresses the queer trans Việt experience, especially the diaspora. I’m excited to, create more of it and also help archive that and document that and celebrate that as we approach, 10, 12 years and into the farther future.

My example is specific to my dad, but I think that we all heal in different ways with ourselves and our relationship to body and spirit, our relationship to other family, other friends, how we relate to each other, how we relate to the world. I see that in, in every one of us.

Jean Pham: Everything Hai is saying is so important and beautiful. The landscape that QTViet formed in eight years ago was in many ways very different from now. There’s a lot more shift in their communities too. Eight years ago, for example, I grew up in Orange County. Little Saigon, outside of Việt Nam, it’s the densest Việt Namese population, where in San Jose, it’s like the largest Việt Namese populations outside of Việt Nam . Still at their core like very deeply conservative locales.

And, it’s one of the reasons why I was seeking community in the eight years since then I think we’ve seen a kind of a shift. Our generation of Việt Namese diasporic students, descendants, inhabitants, we’re challenging the politics, reckoning of, what does it mean for us, who descendants of refugees, people who hold all these different complexities, who also struggling to find our own space, what does it mean for us to, create and shape our own worlds, or to even resist against some of the things we were taught.

I’ve been in QTViệt Cafe for most of my 20s, and I really feel the collective has honestly raised me in many ways that changed me for the better. I remember, one of my first QTViệt Cafe meetings, everyone was just cooking. I came in, like, on time.

I was coming from a very different environment in terms of political organizing, where it’s very we have a set agenda, everything’s really disciplined. In QTViet Cafe spaces, we spend most, like, an hour or two just kind of checking in with each other, making sure everyone just felt okay and present, and able to move. A big part of it is still just being in community, cooking with each other, sharing recipes, and that’s so central to the work.

It’s a slower pace, but I also felt like it’s also ingenuous. It’s really about building relationships and families. So many of us have complicated relationships with our blood families and. within QTViet Cafe spaces, sometimes we do talk about it, and sometimes there is space for us to explore that form of hardship, but people just understand. If we come in a space as a queer and trans Viet, there are certain experiences that are almost unfortunately, , universal, or you can just deeply feel.

And everyone just almost telepathically holds that space for each other in a very, like, beautiful way.

Cheryl Truong: You bring up how last year you were all able to go to Việt Nam, to the motherland. What is the landscape there? Like politically, emotionally, spiritually.

Jean Pham: Yeah, last year we went in October, it was almost a week before Halloween I believe, and we had been preparing for this journey for half a year and it was actually delayed. Originally there were plans for , queer and trans Việt Namese.

to go Việt Nam together in 2020. But because of the onset of the lockdown, these plans were

not scrapped, but just put on pause until we could travel in a meaningful and safe way.

I would say the landscape in Việt Nam with the queer and trans, community we met, it was a big shock to me. It was, very loving, you know, like

When I told my parents I was going my mom sent me this large message about how dangerous Việt Nam is, it’s like a third world country, that people are gonna try to scam me or steal my belongings and that I should always be on guard, that even my friends can’t necessarily be trusted because they might be fooled too.

And I didn’t necessarily believe her all the way, right? I think I thought she was being a little bit just overprotective. And when I met people in Việt Nam, no, it was like the exact opposite. Everyone was very curious, where are you from? Why are you here?

We met with a collective called the Bạc Xỉu Collective. Bạc Xỉu is a type of Việtnamese coffee. I thought it was interesting that both our collectives are named after community spaces that revolve around coffee. The Bạc Xỉu Collective were very, like, loving and open to us.

They were just so curious that our group existed. A lot of them practice the art of drag, but they also had members who were involved with very different art forms, pretty similar to us. I think one of the questions I was trying to reckon with was, what does it mean to explore your queerness and transness, when you’re not confronted with whiteness in the way that we are as people living in America. Obviously, white supremacy is global, but I felt it’s such a new way to be queer in Việt Nam, if that makes sense. One of the highlights from meeting the collective was one of the first nights when we had rented this apartment suite and we invited a lot of the locals to come over and we just had a nice little kiki moment.

We had brought over gifts. Hải is always very hospitable and gracious and prepared. Hải brought this entire suitcase full of seeds of gifts of prints of artwork that we had created and we exchanged it with them and they also just had a moment where we went around in a circle just shared who we are.

It was bilingual. I was really nervous. I was like looking up on Google Translate, how to say something very, it was just like, Hi, my name is Jean. I’m from California. This is something I know how to say, but I was just so nervous in the moment that I was using Google Translate for it. But everyone was so nice. Local people in Việt Nam can speak, especially young people have a level of fluency in English so we were able to communicate pretty effectively, despite some of the language barriers. But I remember they were just interested and wanted to learn more. I honestly wish I could have stayed longer and just been in that moment forever.

I think the last thing I’ll add: we just had a little like cute little party moment and I was like, what music do I put on? And so I just put on my regular music that I put on for, folks at home, like all like the gay boys and stuff I hang out with. And I just found that everyone, like Rihanna is universal.

Like you put on Rihanna and no matter where you are in the world, people will freak out which I thought was so hilarious.

Hai Vo: A thousand percent agree. I loved everything that you shared, Gene. That question around, yeah, I love that you brought up that question.

As someone who grew up a part of my life in the diaspora, white supremacy and whiteness, it’s just, it just happened. It’s just every day. Most of the Bạc Xỉu Collective is a lot younger than our group. Most of the country actually is very young. I think a good percentage, if the majority of the country is under 25. I bring that up because I think that there’s a level of a cultural revolution happening around art in general in Việt Nam in my experience in the last, let’s say last like six years that I’ve been going almost every other year.

And then to be able to meet other queer and trans Viet folks who were born, grew up there, live there, to hear them say things like, Yeah, I want to do drag and I want to do drag forever and this is what’s going to free me and liberate me. , that’s like very inspiring. I think in many ways, those of us who grew up here or, had time here in the diaspora, whiteness kind of, distracts, makes distractions, , and so , to, hear these young queer, Việt, local folks be so adamant and, and really, , trying, like, they’re going to shows, they’re making their own shows, they start doing their own events, asking for tickets and working with local shops and local bars to make their dreams happen. The one maybe kind of interesting thing that I want to share that I thought about in your question, Jean, is we met Bạc Xỉu Collective at a time when I went back, with Mơ, also part of QTViet Cafe, end of 2022. And up until that point, I had done visits back starting 2018 after my mom passed and, I wanted this trip to be a bit of a pre trip, kind of a research trip, and getting ready for the bigger trip with the dozen of us that Jean mentioned,. So, the night after we landed, we were introduced to the Bạc Xỉu Collective. A lot of these local Việt drag artists started this collective because they were in houses that had folks who were other than Việt, of them white European folks, and so they just were like, we want to create our own all Việt drag house, and do this show all in Việt.

You know, make it bilingual, but centered on Việt-ness. , I think that’s what we’re trying to do. In the diaspora. I think there’s different nuances in the places, but to be able to hear a queer drag Việt show Mostly like 95 percent Việt, and for most of the the space that we were at, was mostly Việt, I was like, oh, this is what it feels like to be at home. It was both and both comforting, exciting, my creative curiosity was going, but also there were moments where I was like, I don’t understand that, you know?

I think they experienced their own challenges as artists over there , in trying to center their Việt-nesa and then we have our challenges here too. but they have a lot of freedom and access and connection to their Việt-ness because that’s our motherland. During our time there where I was able to bring, parts of our altar that we bring and we practice here as part of our gatherings to honor our ancestors and, It was interesting, before that kiki that Jean mentioned I was asked if I could share about the altar, and then for some reason, I think at the end of the night I realized I didn’t share, and then after we danced and catwalked, Some people started leaving. Some of the collective members, noticed the altar, and then they started bowing and recognizing Chị Phụng and Xuân Diệu, and they were wondering who put it together.

I think it was just me noticing them knowing what this is, where I didn’t have to explain. Them just honoring them, just taking a minute, like, it was like a minute of our hundreds of minutes that we had together that night. But I just started getting emotional and crying that night because this is a moment where I don’t have to explain. There’s my kin who get it.

And they looked at me after and they’re like, well, you’re crying. And I’m like, yeah, I’m crying because this practice, this ritual I feel only a few of us get it in the diaspora. What seems so special here in the diaspora is actually just very normal.

They were like, yeah, this is what I know about Chị Phụng and you should look up these other queer ancestors that I didn’t know about. And I’m like, oh my God, this is one of the reasons why I wanna be here. So better understand our people. They were like, yeah, look at this up. Look at this up. Like look this, look up this person. Two nights later when we had our show together, we brought elements of the same altar, but Bạc Xỉu also brought things. They brought, their contributions and offerings to the altar, and food. It was a collaborative ritual that we had together and before the show as part of the hype up and the prep. We got to cúng mǎ to honor our ancestors and I’ll never forget that moment to be able to practice ritual in addition to the show where we’re sharing our expressive creative arts. Everyone knew the importance of why we were doing that and that we come from a deep lineage of queer trans, have probably paved the way and fought for their existence and for our existence to be here. I think that spiritually, that’s a way that I felt like I was able to connect over there. I’d also say in your question, Cheryl, I think the last time I heard the the government approves same sex marriage. I would say culturally, it’s a whole other story. I think because of colonization, imperialism, um, queerness and transness has been erased. And so I think that why it’s so important for us to do this work in the diaspora because, our parents and our elders, they have left a motherland and so there’s a gap in culture and understanding, and, it’s a harder struggle to justify that actually, no, we have queer, trans, Việt history, and we come from a lineage of queer folks, and I think that for me that cultural work is so important because by sharing the history of our people, by sharing our creative expression, by sharing the struggles of, who we are both here in the diaspora and also in Việt Nam.

And a lot of those struggles are around the same things. Family acceptance, belonging, economic justice, employment, , access to resources, access to healthcare, jobs. Those things are actually very similar , in my meeting, in my connecting with queer folks there.

Those systems that are, creating those struggles are the same, like they’re the same capitalist, Corporate imperialist systems. What I’m hopeful for is that what we’re doing as queer and trans Việt folks in the diaspora, connecting with queer and trans Việt folks who are in Việt Nam know– I want to imagine a world without borders.

For me the art and the creativity and trying to transform the struggles that we all experience as queer and trans people to stories and actually life ways of resilience. I’m hoping changing hearts and minds. Will ultimately transform practice and policy. The government might be saying one thing, but at home, it’s actually a different story. That’s why our work is important to try to change heart and minds. I want to get to a place where my dad would be like, okay, yeah, same sex marriage. My child and their friends, are members of the community who are respectful and joyful and wanting to contribute to society, just as much as our, just as much as our queer trans, Việt ancestors have to.

Cheryl Truong: Thank you so much for bringing us here, Hai.

You’ve highlighted some really important point. Colonization capitalism, white supremacy. These are, systems of oppression that while they manifest differently, as you say, they are global in nature and. In escapable and then impact is both here in America and also in Vietnam.

The motherland, like the forces at play are very much the same. I really appreciate the insights that both of you have shared, especially in response to Jean’s extremely evocative question about what it means to explore queerness and transness when you’re not confronted with whiteness. Hai,, your story about the altar and Bạc Xỉu Collective connection to ancestral practices and rituals. They’re embracing of our trans and queer Viet histories. And how. How it creates this deep sense of kinship. I think these are powerful reflections. The diaspora. You know, as you say. As a result of imperialism and capitalism.

Makes us a bit disconnected from these wisdoms at the motherland and what you share truly clarifies. And sharpens. What’s up the forces at play and the vast systemic issues that we’re confronting. But also, it really deepens my admiration for. The extremely revolutionary work that QTVIet Cafe is doing to bridge this gap and are in our world, filled with borders.

Okay. We’re going to take a quick music break. But stay tuned. We’ll be right back.

Cheryl Truong: And we’re back. You were listening to apex express on 94.1, FM KPFA and [e-mail]. You were just listening to change the world by baby Chris.

We are still here with Hai Vo and Jean Pham from QTViet Cafe. For the first half of our show, we were reflecting on what eight years of QTV at cafe means and also learning. And also about the trip that they took together as a collective to Vietnam last year to learn more about trans and queer. Experience of local Vietnamese of local Viet. And of course, as the artists that they all are, they created a film about it.

Let’s get back to the show.

Speaking of changing hearts and minds, tell me about this documentary that you all created when you were in Việt Nam.

Hai Vo: I think the idea started because, so my parents and my brother left as boat people in 86 and I was born In Iowa in 87 after being sponsored by a Presbyterian Church.

I went for the first time to Việt Nam when I was 7 and again when I was 12. I remember my parents were obsessed with camcorders. I don’t know if you all have this but, there’s still so many VHS tapes that I think I need to digitize, But I think the spirit of homeland trips being documented in my family is such a thing.

When I was thinking about this trip, 2018, when I started coming back when I was 12, it wasn’t until 22 years later, when I was 34, that I came back after my mom passed. Going back, I was , curious about how people document their experience going back to the homeland and these days with reels and social media, people doing daily blogs and just all the things, I was curious. But I think there’s an element of that kind of old school, just document everything. And then coming back here a few weeks later, just over dinner, just see everything unedited. Um, so, yeah, that was part of the inspiration and then fortunately, 1 of our collective members, and, and members Tracy Nguyen and folks with the Sunkist SunKissed,they’ve been documenting the QTViet Cafe experience since the beginning, really.

So much of what’s on YouTube and online of our work is, through their documentation. Basically was like, Sal, I don’t have a lot of money. We don’t have a lot of money, but here’s a little bit of money that I fundraise so far and we can keep fundraising as part of the collective effort. What do you say about trying to document this experience with us? I think what’s so powerful about the collective is by it for us. Knowing that Sal and other folks who practice videography and film are already part of the collective and are already interested in a trip, I think, it’s easier to share and connect on the goal of connecting with other queer and trans folks.

We’ve never done a trip like this and then two, we’ve never documented a trip like this. Everything was new. And we were going into it. We had like ideas of how we wanted to film this and there were some proposals and we Filmed some of the activities that we had before the trip like some of our planning retreats and some of our fundraising events. Sal did some interviews of how we felt before in all the feelings of like anxious and excited, nervous.

And I ultimately was just like, Sal, here’s our best agenda, here’s like a guide of what each day will look like. Ultimately, I want to give all of us a creative permission just experience this trip and to let’s do our best to document it.

And as long as we’re truthful and honest. As long as we can just share our full humanhood, whatever happens on the other side, I think will be amazing. After that, it just had a little bit of relief knowing that. Honestly, we were inspired by Videos that other queer trans folks were doing in Việt Nam. It’s like abstract and editorial and like voiceover and like, it’s just like, just put it out there. That was part of our inspo. I think just as much as, our identities and sexualities and gender are fluid, I wanted to encourage, the film and documentation to be just as fluid. Fortunately, we had folks who were filming and doing sound, and with the support of , everyone in the collective, we’re all taking photos and doing videos.

We’re, hoping to just share honestly and report not just our experience, but also share the struggles that we experienced as queer and trans people, the struggles that queer and trans people, in Việt Nam experience to the power of what it means to collaborate together and, um, do something historic and do a first event there ever. we hope to share our post trip reflections of what it’s meant for us.

Jean Pham: Yeah, it was just like a fun process for us to take upon this trip and each of us in our own way, document it. QTViet Cafe has different disciplines of artists– filmmakers, photographers, writers, dancers, and so forth, that one of the things we were also asked to do was, to take our own photos and to share it throughout the entire process.

For me it was a different experience because this is my first time going to Việt Nam. My parents came here in 89 and I was born in 95. I guess if you’re not a part of the diasporic Việt Namese American population, there are certain, like, ideas held about Việt Nam that some people from the older generation have about, Việt Nam as , a socialist country. And also, like, what it means for people who are refugees to be reckoned with, how their country has transformed. And so I’ve never gone back to Việt Nam because my parents honestly thought this is like a lost country. It’s not home for us anymore. And so a lot of ideas about Việt Nam and what it is now, we’re, Reproduced and given to me and of course, like it’s a lot of unpacking too, right?

Because I honestly don’t believe a lot of these held ideas that they have about Việt Nam. And it was important for me to want to experience that. Việt Nam for myself, in a way where I could truly see what the country is and not in a way that necessarily demonizes it or even romanticizes it.

A lot of like diasporic poetry and art and writing I feel kind of like hinges or teeters that like point of almost romanticizing their ancestral country. And I think it’s important for us to unpack all these like held beliefs and biases. In college, I did a lot of poetry, slam poetry, and I always recognized the language barrier is a big part of access, not being able to fully understand or communicate with our parents is a tension that many like second or third generation Americans face.

The way that I think QTViet Cafe interacts with that is pretty ingenious, but also very, what one should do, which is just simply to learn the language. We need to teach each other the language so that we can communicate with each other in Việt Namese. That was another big part of our preparation too.

Some collective members. held Việt Namese classes for us to talk to each other, talk to locals, talk to other queer folks. And also the language is important because as much as we have our own lingo and slang as queer and trans communities here, so do they in Việt Nam, in Việt Namese.

With the documentary, not everyone has the same experience, right? For me, it was my first time. So I was trying to visit places where my parents grew up, trying to see the city from my own eyes. Some people had a lot more connection with Việt Nam and had visited it, Việt Nam and Saigon many times before.

So in a documentary, there are certain members of the collective that have like more keyed interviews that kind of talk about that difference because even within our collective, we’re not monolithic in terms of our experiences and you can see the different ways like we’re shaped by it.

I think the last thing I’ll share with you is definitely, and Hai, and I kind of talked about this. It’s in conversation pretty often, but a lot of eateries, Việt Namese restaurants in the US are kind of stuck in time because a lot of them are, restaurants that are Staffed and created by diasporic Việt Namese refugees. The food has like definitely developed a lot in Việt Nam. And so has the language. It almost feels like, you know, us in a diaspora, us here in California, we’re in like a time bubble. And going to Việt Nam breaks that. And lets us experience what does Việt Nam look like now in like 2024, 2023. Now that it has like modernized.

You know, most people, most queer and trans Việt Namese people we’ve met were either in underground economies or they’re gig workers or they’re freelance workers. I think there’s a lot of parallels between the ways that queer and trans people move here and also in Việt Nam.

Although there is definitely like that point of us visiting Việt Nam as Americans. or people who have American passports, there is a class dynamic to it. So yeah, it, I would say part of the complication is There are things we were trying to resolve within our own bodies by going back to Việt Nam, but also things we had to reckon with, like the differences too, and how, I think for me, one of the most jarring things was realizing that in Saigon, there are provinces or like neighborhood, entire neighborhoods that are home to just people who immigrated out from their countries and had access to a larger degree of wealth and who are actively perhaps displacing Saigonese locals and realizing that if I wasn’t careful, then these are structural issues that can be created if we don’t examine our place like in context.

Yeah. And I’ll check there. Yeah.

Cheryl Truong: Thanks so much for sharing Jean and Hai. That’s just about all the time we have left tonight. For those interested in seeing the premiere of their Đồng Quể documentary, learning more about QTViet Cafe. And or celebrating eight years of queer trans Viet magic, please join QTViet Cafe on September 1st in Oakland, California. They will be having an exciting celebration. ? Hai, how can people learn more?

Hai Vo: Yeah, we’re excited to invite everyone to our eight year anniversary. We’re premiering Đồng Quể, which is the film of their Việt Nam trip. We are planning to have it, on Sunday, September 1st. 5 to 9 at Firehouse Oakland in Chinatown. And, yeah, we’re live on the tickets and registration.

It’ll be up on our IG, @qtvietcafe, it’ll be up on our Facebook, it’ll be up on our website. Folks can also subscribe to our newsletter too via our website. Yeah, September 1st, Sunday, evening time, 5 to 9, Chinatown at Firehouse in Oakland.

Cheryl Truong: Thank you all. So thank you both so much for being here for coming on the show. And for our listeners, please join us September 1st at the firehouse in Oakland. You hear all of these stories, these intimate details at Jean and Hai have shared with us income to live. For those interested in learning more. QTViet Cafe’s socials Facebook, Instagram website, all that good stuff will be in the show notes as well as a link to their registration form. As well as their bilingual letter for a free Palestine. That was written in collaboration with members of QTViet Cafe, the Dallas, Asian American historical society, and also various other community supporters.

This letter is bilingual. It starts off with dear family. And is meant to catalyze an intergenerational conversation about Palestine. Everyone has a different relationship story to our families and lineage, so this resource is a conversation starter so please check it out.

It’ll also be in the show notes.

Thank you all so much for listening and I’ll see you next time. .

Apex express is produced by Miko Lee, Paige Chung, Jalena Keane-Lee, Preeti Mangala Shekar. Shekar, Anuj Vaidya, Kiki Rivera, Swati Rayasam, Nate Tan, Hien Nguyen, Nikki Chan, and Cheryl Truong

Tonight’s show was produced by me, cheryl. Thanks to the team at KPFA for all of their support. And thank you for listening!

The post APEX Express – August 22, 2024 – 8 Years of QTViet Cafe! appeared first on KPFA.